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SJAAK is right. The reason you see so much crazy stuff is because people play really loose with fake money and therefore more hands get made and a lot more suckouts happen.

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Bad beats happen all the time, but for people to play this game for more than a month then say that there not are waaaaay too many odd defying suckouts, they are delusional or in on it. Lol.  IJS...If you are all in against the big stack, don't be shocked to see runner-runner for the suck-out on the river...no matter how far they are behind.  It happens at least 75% of the time and they are usually so odds-defying that you have to have a drink afterwards. 

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My anecdote for when I feel I am on a bad luck streak or feeling that the game has "selected" a winner is to buy stuff for my character. Find a balance of stockpiling chips and putting them towards items. After all you can't lose outfits and table items in a ring match. :)

 

That strategy actually works in real life too, when at a casino and your up, go buy dinner or put it towards your bill. Then go gamble with what you got left, you'll be a far happier gambler. 

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Back in the days of nickel mechanical slots and  $2 blackjack, I'd drive from  San Francisco to the casinos of Reno.  When I stayed for a couple of days and won enough to pay for gas, room, meals and a show. I considered it a win-win.

After a blackjack hand the dealer would discuss the odds of the game just played and pit-bosses would join the conversation. 

Different times.

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On 28.9.2016 at 11:48 PM, Terry said:

I hardly ever see a win with just a high card and been playing for over a month I'm level 252. Someone always has something just for bidding wars. Just today I've seen 3 runners where someone would only need one card but hey there's always that flush possibility on the table. I see it constantly it's rigged and I'm sure others will agree

Perhaps you don't know that winning by high card is less likely in Texas hold'em than winning with a pair. In other words, getting a high card is less likely than getting a pair.

It's ironic that a pair is considered "better" than a high card, even though a pair is more likely to happen, but it was decided a long time ago that Texas hold'em would have the same hand rankings as all other poker formats.

So someone winning with a high card is actually a relatively rare circumstance, according to the probabilities.

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1 hour ago, Warp said:

Perhaps you don't know that winning by high card is less likely in Texas hold'em than winning with a pair. In other words, getting a high card is less likely than getting a pair.

It's ironic that a pair is considered "better" than a high card, even though a pair is more likely to happen, but it was decided a long time ago that Texas hold'em would have the same hand rankings as all other poker formats.

So someone winning with a high card is actually a relatively rare circumstance, according to the probabilities.

You have a 48.7% chance of pairing by the river and a 51.3% chance of NOT hitting a pair.  

There's not much in it, but to say that a pair is more likely, is not true. 

Edited by Zanatoo

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1 hour ago, Zanatoo said:

You have a 48.7% chance of pairing by the river and a 51.3% chance of NOT hitting a pair.  

There's not much in it, but to say that a pair is more likely, is not true. 

According to this, there's a 43.8% chance of getting a pair, and a 17.4% of getting no pair. Even getting two pair is more likely, at 23.5%.

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4 hours ago, Warp said:

According to this, there's a 43.8% chance of getting a pair, and a 17.4% of getting no pair. Even getting two pair is more likely, at 23.5%.

ahh yes, but that's including hands where the pair (or two pair) occurs anywhere within the 7 cards in play, ie. it includes hands where the board pairied. I'm talking only of hands where one of your two hole cards makes a pair with the board.

As it's harder to hit a pair than to not hit one, it's correct that a pair should rank higher than no pair (high card). 

It's an interesting topic though. 

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As a poker professional, seems the tournies arent rigged, rather weak players willing to call with anything at lower levels. You see this in real life at low buyin and/or rebuy tournies.

The ring games, however, are highly suspicious.

If you play high stakes, watch for a player or two at the table that seem to have a rediculous reading ability, almost knowing what cards you have without having watched you play over time. 

Same player(s) is usually provisional or low level, and gets miraculous cards at a unbelievable rate when the chips are in.

Sucks, since I thought Prominence would be a fun hobby site for me. 

Anyone arguing, let me ask you this. Where are hand histories? Why not implement them? I won't be spending another dime until this issue is addressed.

Edited by UntameableAnge1

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Just to be clear, I am not saying the RNG is rigged. I am also not saying Prominence is placing 'master accounts' that can see hole cards or control cards in ring games. 

I am just warning other players to be wary on high stakes ring games (500k+), that something just doesn't seem quite right.

I just don't know where to point, since selling chips doesn't seem like it's a big business to anyone, except Prominence.

Hand histories, more qualifications to join higher stake ring games (such as requirement to finish provisionals, more provisionals to begin with [seven instead of three]), more options on joining ring games (such as level requirement), would not only deter cheaters (if that's the problem) - but also showcase the fact that you do realize there's an issue, and you are trying to be completely transparent.

I find it pretty hard to believe that there's lots of players that are going to get the game for pretty much free, then spend $50-$100 just to buy a mill+ chips, skip tournies completely (which showcase more skill then ring games), then use a huge portion of their bankroll to play high stakes, then happen to have X-Ray vision, and were born on Saint Patrick's Day to boot.

Edited by UntameableAnge1

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As a "poker professional" you should know that sometimes it's relatively easy to read people just by their betting behavior (when and how they check or bet, and even how fast they are doing so when their turn comes).

When I play, I take it as a challenge to guess people's hole cards, by observing how they bet. Sometimes I get it surprisingly right (although, sadly, way too often the round doesn't go to showdown). In some situations it's really easy to guess at least one of their cards (at least the rank).

If you think somebody's hacking the system to get hidden information, you should provide more proof than just a hunch.

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I know its poker and bad beats happen all the time but dam. How many times have ive seen bottem hand getting crush suck out on the river today its almost unreal. 6 time in a row where the worst hand going in won and it seems it always AK - 10 3  A nd you just know a 3 will pop up on the river. Or  runner runner runner flush . I know when im all in and have qq kk  i think im going to lose when i see someone calll with a 56 lol  or like my last hand  88 guy goes all in 42  you know it trip 2s lol

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11 hours ago, Warp said:

Any video evidence of that?

Lol no sorry i dont take vids of my games. But  whatever im  just saying what ive seen. I realize  its fake money and ppl well and do play anything. It just when you see crazy shit happening all the time it makes you wonder. Last night to start off a game the first 4 hands had pairs on the flop. There is like a 16% chance  of a pair on the flop im guessing 4 in a row is way way under 1% . Maybei m just having a bad day at the tables lol

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I don't see "crazy shit happening all the time". Either the game is targeting you specifically (unlikely), or you are seeing patterns where there are none (more likely).

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I've been playing poker for 22 years, 5 of them professionally. I've easily seen over 500,000 hands of poker. This game is absolute nonsense. I constantly see the same players winning pots, regardless of their hand, regardless of what is on the board, and regardless of equity and value. I will miss 11+ outs for 2 hours straight in this game while I watch the same players rip off 2 and 4 outers seemingly every time they play a hand. Hands down worst poker game I have ever played. They need to bring back WSOP: Full House Poker. Now that was a great multiplayer poker game. 

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17 hours ago, Botch said:

I've been playing poker for 22 years, 5 of them professionally. I've easily seen over 500,000 hands of poker. This game is absolute nonsense. I constantly see the same players winning pots, regardless of their hand, regardless of what is on the board, and regardless of equity and value. I will miss 11+ outs for 2 hours straight in this game while I watch the same players rip off 2 and 4 outers seemingly every time they play a hand. Hands down worst poker game I have ever played. They need to bring back WSOP: Full House Poker. Now that was a great multiplayer poker game. 

        WSOP Full House Pro and PP were  created by the same people and WSPO fhp was written to run on a XB Gold console.  I seriously doubt that the basic logic was altered.  

  

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Point being, there is no logic in this game. Bad beats certainly happen in poker, but the math is always the same. Situational hands that happen 12% of the time happen 60 % of the time in this game. It's not like I've played this game once or twice and ran badly. It's a circus operated by a horrible algo everytime. 

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On 6/3/2019 at 3:29 AM, Botch said:

I've been playing poker for 22 years, 5 of them professionally. I've easily seen over 500,000 hands of poker. This game is absolute nonsense. I constantly see the same players winning pots, regardless of their hand, regardless of what is on the board, and regardless of equity and value. I will miss 11+ outs for 2 hours straight in this game while I watch the same players rip off 2 and 4 outers seemingly every time they play a hand.

Yet, I don't. How is that possible?

The only possible explanation is that the game is targeting you in particular, and rigging the game against you and in favor of your opponents whenever you are playing. After all, consider that this always happens in favor of your opponents, never in favor of you, according to your own account ("I will miss 11+ outs for 2 hours straight in this game while I watch the same players rip off 2 and 4 outers seemingly every time they play a hand.")

If the game where simply flawed and badly programmed, then you would sometimes notice this trend favoring you, at the cost of your opponents. Sometimes you would get astronomically unlikely lucky streaks, winning with really crappy hands, while your opponents will be losing with their picture cards and pocket aces. But according to your own testimony, this never favors you. It always favors your opponents.

Therefore the only possible explanation is that the game is specifically targeting you, and benefiting your opponents, whenever you in particular are playing. You must be in some kind of blacklist, for whatever reason.

Or, you know, and I know this might sound silly, but the other explanation is that you are just imagining things.

Would you seriously think that the game has been rigged specifically against you, so that the allegedly incorrect odds are always against you, never in favor of you? Would you seriously think that you have been put in some kind of blacklist, where you specifically are being targeted for discrimination when it comes to odds?

A different hypothesis has been presented a million times already: Prominence Poker is not like "normal" poker for one reason: People don't play with real money here. It's all play money. Therefore they have nothing to lose. And because they have nothing to lose, they will keep playing with hands that any experienced poker player would have folded if playing for real money. When you have 5 other players playing like they don't care how much they lose, the amount of bad beats that you witness will inevitably increase.

The problem with professional poker is that you don't get to see how many bad beats there would have been, had players not folded, and kept continuing betting like there's no tomorrow. You don't get to see what happens if someone does a completely crazy all-in with something like a 9-3 off color.

Edited by Warp
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Comparing playing Hold ‘Em professionally to playing Prominence Hold ‘Em is a stretch to begin with. While some players may have bought chips to buffer their stacks so that they can play in the high stakes ring games, there is no “real” money involved in these games. It is a very loose environment in most cases and trying to apply the same playing style you would use at the Bellagio lends itself to seeing bad beat after bad beat.

I see a regular cast of characters at many of the $1M/$2M tables after playing this game for several years and I respect many of them because they play smart, tight poker. Bad beats happen so often because so many hands in ring games go to the river. How people don’t get that is beyond me. There is no rigging and the game engine is solid. Either you can handle the loose play from some, or you can’t. It’s that simple.

Hell, I play loose some nights just to rankle people. I got dealt four pocket pairs out of six hands the other night, flopped trips on two of those four, and busted AK in a pre-flop all-in race. That’s pretty much a coin flip. The guy I busted called me a hacker, etc... Nope, just poker. 

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